Readers have asked for a while for this post: something recommending a core, versatile shirt collection.
The idea of suggesting such ‘capsule’ collections is that they help a newcomer build a wardrobe, prioritising the things that will give them the greatest versatility with other clothing and in different situations.
Previous capsule collections on ties are here, and handkerchiefs here.
With shirts, such a collection can seem pretty straightforward. But there are a surprising number of variables, and formality drives decisions more than with other accessories.
To deal with this, I’ve listed below two separate shirt collections: one formal (for a fairly professional office) and one informal (for an informal office, or casual wear).
The reader can then pick their own capsule collection by selecting five shirts from the two lists that best suit their life and lifestyle.
Formal capsule collection
1. Plain-blue poplin
Poplin is the most versatile of weaves for a business shirt (detail here). Light blue is the most versatile colour (it goes with more colours and flatters more skin tones). And a plain shirt goes with the most ties, knitwear and tailoring (no clashing of patterns). This is the place to start for a business shirt, therefore. You may even want two in your collection of five.
2. A thin or pale stripe
Stripes are the easiest way to add interest to a shirt, and are usually a nicer partner for a solid tie. But keep the stripes thin or pale so that they don’t risk clashing with a tie or suit with similar density of pattern. A bengal stripe is one of the most popular and appealing choices – just keep the blue quite pale.
3. Plain white
White is always the smartest colour, and every man should have one in their wardrobe.
Smart and sombre with a dark tie with a small geometric pattern; summery with paler and brighter colours.
4. Pink
For most business environments, the first colour after blue and white is pink. Gone are the days when this was considered effeminate – today there’s greater risk of it making you look like a banker or lawyer, if you are not one. Either way, it’s great with dark ties and a beautiful partner to grey suits. Keep it a pale, though.
5. Vary the collar or cuffs
For ease and simplicity, I’d suggest having all these four shirts in the same combination of collar and cuff – say a moderate spread collar and a single cuff. Your fifth could repeat one of those, but in a different design: a plain-blue button-down perhaps, or a white shirt with a double cuff.
Informal capsule collection
1. Chambray, plain blue or white
Chambray is hard to pin down, as by definition it’s just a fabric with a coloured warp and a white weft. But it has come to mean one with slubs in the weft creating an irregular, and therefore more casual, texture. In this guise, it is the perfect bridge between formal and casual. A cotton/linen mix can often achieve the same effect.
2. Button-down oxford
A traditional oxford shirt is one step further down the formality scale. Still lovely with a blazer and flannels, but also at home with jeans. Get a thicker, traditional oxford with a rougher yarn that creates more texture, and helps it age well. Probably plain blue or a blue/white stripe, and with a button-down collar.
3. Denim
Another step down the scale is denim. A denim shirt can be worn with tailoring, but is an unusual choice. It’s partner in terms of formality is a pair of chinos or similar casual trousers: canvas, corduroy, moleskin. It can go with all of them though, and is therefore quite versatile. Just probably not with jeans.
4. Brushed cotton
A brushed-cotton or wool shirt is clearly casual, but can happily be worn under a woollen jacket. A nice variation in texture, which often makes it nicer in simple colours and patterns. A grey, a cream, a light-blue herringbone. Linen is, to a certain extent, the summer equivalent.
5. A gingham or tattersall check
In terms of variation by pattern, checks largely belong in the casual collection, with stripes in the formal one. The biggest problem with checks, though, is they come with baggage. A tattersall check might be too British rural, Madras too American preppy. There will often be one that escapes these in your eyes – and if there isn’t, add another oxford or chambray in a different colour.
Selecting five out of those 10 should give you a good capsule collection. Which would best suit your office?
Photography: Jamie Ferguson or Permanent Style, except 2 and 5 striped shirts, James Munro
An article for the ‘masses’ .
Many, many thanks.
More of this please ….trousers ?
Ooo. I think trousers might be even harder to tailor to different lifestyles.
We have done some in the past, eg this on the best trousers with sports jackets
The links to the handkerchiefs and ties articles are swapped.
D’oh!
Thanks, I’ll fix that now
Hi Simon, I only wear 4 shirts after having 5 made by Simone Abbarchi 18 months ago.
1/ plain blue linen
2/ denim
3/ pale pink
4/ plain blue long collar button down.
5/ plain white
1, 2, 3, 4 all worn Monday to Thursday.
All single cuff and all except 4 with the same moderate spread collar.
1 & 2 I wear on occasional nights out, and always take on holiday (hot or cold).
5 I’ve worn once for the Christmas party.
They’re all holding up well, and I should make it well into next year without making another order. I’m sure I will spend less on shirts over 3 years than my TM Lewin colleagues (who are unable to do their top button up).
Absolutely agree with Robin above – a similar piece about trousers would be most welcome! And I know you’ve done a piece before about cycling to work and would love to hear about a capsule wardrobe of trousers that would support that
Hello Simon, great article as always. What’s the difference between chambray and denim, in shirting? I’ve never been quite sure; the amount of white in the weft perhaps?
And to which mills and bunches would you recommend for some great denim cloth? My shirtmaker can’t seem to lay his hands on any. (Apart from your PS denim of which I have two lengths – and love; the fading and feathering is just starting to happen on the first of the shirts I’ve had made up – but I’m keen for something a little darker too).
Cheers,
Thanks Nick.
As mentioned, chambray is a tricky one as it has come to mean something different to its original definition. Have a look at our weaves post in the shirt fabrics guide for more, but chambray today is basically more about uneven texture or colour, while denim is about the indigo colour of the fabric.
In terms of other denims, I don’t know many I’m afraid and they change all the time. But I would look to the Victoria range from Albini, and the seasonal Canclini options
Simon, what about the PS everyday denim? I found a fabric that looks similar but must be chambray since the weave is straight and, as far as I understand, the PS one, being denim, should have a twill weave.
Yes, a denim would normally be a twill, and the PS one is.
There are similar denims out there, but the PS one is my favourite and fades more than most – which is what stopped it being commercial originally.
Simon, have you tried Shirtonomy?
No I haven’t.
Great post with loads of practical value, Simon. I virtually leaped with joy when you included pink in the formal shirt collection. I’ve a soft spot for that color, and believe that it could also work in the informal collection as an button-down oxford.
Nice point, yes
The idea of a capsule collection of shirts seems silly to me. Of all the items in a man’s wardrobe, shirts are supposed to be the most rapidly worn out and replaced, and they have to go to the cleaner. A working man should have a dozen at the very least.
Good point Will, you’re certainly more likely to have more than five – but they may still very well be within these ten types, given you often want consistency there.
Simon, to this point I’ve seen a shirt maker supply extra replacement collars and cuffs along with a bespoke shirt, to be swapped in when the originals stain or are just worn out. Seems brilliant to me, but what are your thoughts? My collars go long before anything else.
That can work very well Will, but usually only with white shirts as the body will change colour slightly, or fade, and the collar and cuffs look odd if slightly different in colour
They don’t have to go to the cleaner Will, I wash and iron my own. Gentle cycle machine wash and tumble dry on low then iron. They last longer that way too, been doing this for at least 5 years now and the bulk of my T&A and Emma Willis shirts are in great shape, I do my bespokes this way as well! Dry clean everything as little as possible, it is hell on fabric.
Absolutely. Though ideally don’t tumble dry either…
As far as washing and ironing are concerned, I am completely with David. I would only like to add that in addition to avoiding the tumble dryer (don’t even think of buying one, especially if you are living on your own) you might consider spinning at 100 rpms helpful in order to limit wear and creasing.
Can’t go with the pink at all.
It really is the estate agent’s staple.
A grey flannel is essential in the casual section.
I personally find gentle, warmish pinks (in the direction of peach) much more wearable than the more common bluish pinks, which can be a bit harsh, even when they’re pale.
Couldn’t disagree more – pink works so well with other colours and suits so many skin tones. Apart from the lovely picture above of pink with grey flannels, there are some great pink shirts worn by Prince Charles and Sean Connery – to take two out of countless examples – which aren’t remotely reminiscent of estate agency. However, life would be terribly dull if we all had the same views.
Hi Simon
Another great article. I am with you across both the formal and informal collections, with the exception of denim. As someone approaching middle age – mid 40s – I have become quite nervous about wearing a denim shirt and looking as though I am trying to recapture my youth. However, I also see the enjoyment you find in a denim shirt and so wonder if I am looking at the wrong styles or cloths. If I may ask, how did you find a denim you loved enough to add it to the PS collection? Did you go for a lighter weight or is it about the cut? Your advice would be greatly appreciated.
Hi Richard.
I can understand your concern. Can I ask, are you looking at ready-to-wear shirts? Most are much more obviously denim, with heavier washes, and might be too casual. Fabrics offered for bespoke shirts often have the opposite problem, of being too formal, barely fading at all. Ours was the fabric I found that cut a nice middle way, and to many people might not even look like denim
Hi Simon,
Thanks for the reply.
My budget for bespoke is limited and so I tend to focus on suits and odd jackets; I have recently commissioned a cashmere odd jacket from W&S, getting ready for autumn. For shirts, I have been fortunate enough to find that Budd’s tailored range fits me very well, and so I have never felt the need to divert some of my budget towards bespoke. As you say, the RTW denim shirts I have looked at do seem much to casual for me. Hopefully you will have some of the PS denim shirts available at the next pop up shop and I might be converted.
I’ll be interested to hear your views.
We’ll also have some more on the shop site later in the year.
Simon, you’ve commented before on English men’s propensity towards more striking shirts because of historic restrictions on ties to club colours. What do you think drew you towards your own rather restrained palette of shirt colours? Did you ever go in for multi-coloured stripes when you had your shirts made at T&A?
I’m not a fan of pink, personally. I’ve always found a cream (or some version of it) shirt to be very useful. A shirt in a nice neutral shade is very flexible and goes with lots of different things. Having said that, I really struggle to find decent cream shirts that don’t simply look like a pale yellow, which I dislike.
Yes, getting shades of cream that are colder and bluer is hard
I’ve been shunning cream shirts since someone (my mother…) remarked a few years ago that the one I was wearing looked like old shirt that used to be white. I thought she had a point, and still think she does. I’d be curious to know what your take is on this one, Simon.
And by the way, you promised me in a comment a couple of years ago that you’d do a piece on how you care for, iron, and fold your shirts. Hope you’ll get around to it sometime soon!
Cheers,
David
Hey David – apologies, I will!
White shirts are pretty much always best for business, as they look cleaner and sharper, and we are now so used to wearing them and not cream that it’s not surprising your mother thought it was a dirty white.
Personally, I like cream just as a very casual option when white would look too formal – for example, in a brushed-cotton shirt worn under a shetland sweater.
Hi Simon,
What are you’re thoughts on a sky blue pinpoint weave? Would you say it more versatile than poplin (too formal) and oxford (too casual)? I would like to find something that pairs well with mid grey flannel trousers as well as jeans.
Many thanks!
Pinpoint certainly sits in between those two, but I’d say it’s too smart for jeans, personally
Good article Simon, thank you. For those starting out on building a wardrobe articles such as these are invaluable as they focus costs and build knowledge – so much money can be wasted on unwise choices in this period. I agree on the trousers suggestion. I also suggested one (in your last article) on suits; sports jackets, shoes and outerwear/coats could also follow? All would be welcome.
Thanks, and yes good call on all of them.
More quality, fewer things.
I would second the suggestions on more of these articles – they are among the ones I find more useful and accessible to all readers!
Real dilemma
Blue trousers. White shirt? Blue shirt? Pink shirt?
I really cant make up my mind.
Very useful article. Of course, any working professional will own and use well more than five shirts, this provides a useful baseline. And the explanations for the utility of each shirt type provide useful guidance in adjusting that baseline to suit your own particular needs. For instance, if I were arguing in court all the time, I would own a lot of white shirts, because they’re the most formal kind. But if I were a university student, I probably would have no white shirts at all but would favor shirts that can easily go with both trousers, chinos and jeans. (E.g., a blue and white bengal will look good with jeans but can also be smartened up with a navy knit tie.
I found that my own preferences have shifted over the years. I’m an American, but spent 7 years in England during my 20s, including 5 years at Oxford University. At the time, English men tended to favor much bolder patterns and brighter colors, and I was influenced quite a bit by that trend.
At the time, I didn’t have money to spend on tailored clothing, so my way of making a statement was by using colorful shirts, bold ties, cuff links, etc. But as I’ve acquired better quality suits and sports jackets, I’ve toned down the shirts and ties a lot, since I’d rather draw attention to the tailored garments than on the shirts and ties. As far as shirts go, my focus is primarily on fit. If I want to add interest, I do so with texture rather than color or pattern.
I’d like to point out that it’s “Its partner”, not “It’s partner”
Dear Simon,
thanks a lot for all those articles. I’m really happy to see this one popping now as I was planning to get a new set of shirts done in the near future, for business with a tie mostly.
I had a question regarding cuffs in that setting since you advise to get mostly simple cuffs and my initial plan was to get mostly double as I prefer how they look and feel, is there a reason not to go with those doubles and why?
Thanks
Not particularly Joel, it’s mostly a personal style choice. They are a little less versatile – not suitable for more casual trousers, where single cuffs can easily go between the two
Dear Simon
Can you illustrate us on two tone shirts . How to use….?
It’s not something I wear or really like to be honest
Thank goodness!!
Hi Simon – where can we source casual fabrics, such as chambrey, from? From my experience, bespoke shirtmakers tend to stock up more formal fabrics.
Thank you!
You can’t really, I’m afraid… It’s the reason I’ve been developing my own on the shop part of the site. There is a denim and an oxford there. The oxford is currently sold out, but it will be available as RTW shirts from Wednesday
Thank you! I’ve got both the oxford and the denim, love them both.
Oh good
How much use do you get out of shirt in picture #5 the light grey stripes? Thinking about adding it but would be keen to hear the versatility
It’s no where near as useful as a blue stripe, but I do wear it. Essentially, I think you can wear it with everything apart from grey trousers
Hey Simon I have quite a bit of experience with my shirt sleeve lengths where I buy rtw and wash them before bringing them to my tailor. The sleeves are perfect and end exactly at my wristbone. However, I realise subsequent washing causes further shrinking. Also, wearing a jacket over the shirt sometimes causes the armhole of the shirt to hike up and the sleeve s go up with it. This causes the shirt sleeves to be even shorter than the jacket sleeve. I also have this experience with Mtm where the shirt sleeve length is perfect when the shirt is delivered but washing causes the shirt sleeves to be shorter than the jacket sleeve. Wondering if you experience such issues and how one should mitigate them. This can be quite frustrating especially when I see some of my favourite shirts have shrunk and they show no cuff when wearing jackets. Is it also okay to not show cuffs?
It’s fine to not show them, but most people today would prefer to show a little style-wise.
The issue is to do with cloth shrinking after it has been washed. Most good shirtings will have been pre-washed so won’t shrink more; cheaper ones may not have been. And often shirtmakers will wash some fabrics to check for shrinkage as well
Simon,
Do you view pink shirts as more suitable for spring and summer (e.g., I won’t wear pastels like lavender, even in a subtle stripe, except in spring or summer)? It occurs to me that it might depend on the shade of pink—the colder and paler the shade and hue the better suited it is for the colder months, and the stronger and more pastel the shade and hue, the better it is for warmer months).
Nice point. Personally I don’t find pink that dependent on the season, where I would with other colours like lavenedar or pale green perhaps.
But that’s probably because of that point – that it is pale. A stronger colour needs stronger and warmer light.
Hey simon, I’m currently looking at the drake’s 3 oxfords for a cheaper price deal and am considering between the pink (https://www.drakes.com/shirts/pink-oxford-regular-fit-shirt-with-button-down-collar)
and the burgundy/red ticking stripe oxford (https://www.drakes.com/shirts/red-ticking-stripe-regular-fit-shirt-with-button-down-collar). I mostly only wear grey odd trousers and am wondering if one goes better with grey trousers or do they both pair equally well?
I’d go for the red stripe personally. It looks like a pink pretty much anyway, but has a little more interest to it, without limiting ties etc that could go with it
Thank you simon!
Curious. Which three would you pick?
https://www.drakes.com/shirts/3-shirt-promotion
It depends what you have already obviously, but if starting from scratch then a plain blue, blue stripe, and either red stripe or white
Simon, if you were pressed to pick only four shirts out of the extended list (formal and casual) – what are the most fundamental and versatile options (let’s say the more casual formal and the more formal casual options). The first bespoke order at Turnbull and Asser is a minimum of four shirts – what should they be?
Hi Omri,
I think it just depends on how you will wear them – is this more an office with a suit every day, or for one without suits, or for a mixture?
If you’re going to T&A, I assume it’s for the former, but that’s the thing upon which the thing turns.
Simon,
I work in a university, so there’s a mix of formal/casual, though it tends to be on the casual side. I gave little thought to T&A’s tendencies. I’ll be in London and I never had a bespoke shirt made. I figured they are the place to go. Would you recommend a different place, or perhaps put this investment away for a later chance when I am in Napoli, for example?
For those who have no MTM/bespoke tailors, nor trunk shows around, tourism is the only option. How should one plan a short trip? I had a fantasy of ordering a first batch of shirts in-store, and ordering them via mail in later times. Is this even viable?
Thank you
Hi Omri. It is viable to order like that, but I wouldn’t do so with T&A unless you only want more formal shirts. And I wouldn’t go to somewhere that requires a minimum of six. It’s a lot of wasted money if you don’t like the style. Is recommend trying Luca Avitabile from Naples or Simone Abbarchi from Florence, in those cities or when they visit London. Abbarchi in particular if you’re just starting out
Much appreciated, Simon. Thank you.
Hi Simon. What about T&A shirts makes them more formal? I know the T&A shirts lack the hand sewn collars that allow Italian shirts to sit better without a tie, so T&A shirts work best only with a tie. As well, the Italians do a more tailored fit through the body while T&A defaults to a boxy cut that’s best under a jacket. Is that it? Or is there more to T&A shirts which makes them formal?
I was under the impression that there’s little difference in shirt style between English and Italian makers, so either can span the formal to casual styling. It’s more the Italian construction (functional hand sewing of collar and sleeve, tailored fit) which makes it more suitable for casual wear as well as formal, while the English are good for formal only. (And given the price difference, Italian shirts are therefore much better value.)
Good to hear you’ve been reading in detail!
My experience with T&A and similar English makers, and those of friends, is that they don’t have the experience of making casual shirts, and therefore it’s a question of style and cut, as well as make.
I wouldn’t say T&A is necessarily that boxy though, it’s much more up to the customer
Hi simon I’m looking to add a shirt to my wardrobe (mostly solid blue or blue university stripe) would you say a solid pink oxford or something novel like this (https://angloitalian.com/products/ocbd-shirt-reverse-stripe-blue-oxford) will be more casual/versatile?
That stripe will be very nice and casual, as would a pink oxford. The others will probably always be more versatile though
Simon,
Do you have any thoughts about different bespoke shirt makers in London less covered in the site? For example: Sean O’flynn vs. Emma Willis.
I’ve had shirts made by both Sean and Emma in the past. Both were good, but I wouldn’t say there’s much to separate them – and from what I’m aware of they all have that common issue with English shirtmakers of making less for casual wear, buttondowns, shirts without ties etc
Hi Simon, what are your thoughts on lavender shirts (pale ones) and one piece collar respectively?
Lavender shirts are tricky – personally I’d avoid them, though I would wear a lavender and white stripe. That would be more versatile too I think.
One-piece collars can be great, but are a little showy. I think they’re nice in more casual, holiday outfits and when other things are simple – see this post for some thoughts on them
Dear Simon,
I’m wondering about how different shirting fabrics comport with different styles of collar. I teach at a major US university where the level of formality in dress ranges quite a bit. In general, though, my colleagues never wear ties, so I’ll be avoiding them also. I’ve heard you say before that you prefer button down collars when going without a tie, which makes sense to me. I’m about to have some shirts made (by Simone Abbarchi) and would like to get some blue and white poplins, as you’ve suggested for the business “capsule” above. But I am wondering: is the pairing of button down collar with poplin shirt a mismatch in degrees of formality? Any advice would be much appreciated!
Best,
David
Hi David,
A poplin would be on the smarter end of something you’d make as a button-down, but it wouldn’t look odd. I would suggest that perhaps you have one poplin made, and one oxford (perhaps our PS Oxford cloth – sorry, I am biased as I love it so much) and you can see which you personally like the most. You’d wear both, but much of it is personal preference that develops over time.
Simon
Hi Simon, this is yet another good article to read. And some advice from you please.
My office setting is smart casual. Hence, I can do a knitwear with trousers/jeans combination when I need to give my Oxford button downs a rest. Also, I wear white Common Projects to work everyday.
And I really admire how a shirt can accentuate a man’s physique. But I feel that a poplin with a spread collar is rather too smart with trousers and sneakers. Do you have suggestions on fabrics that look great with a spread collar but doesn’t feel too formal to wear like poplin?
P.S. I don’t do chambray, linen or denim due to preference. Thus, I need your insight on this.
Hi Rashdan,
If you want something more casual, and those types you mention are not ones you like, then I would make an oxford with a spread collar. Oxfords vary a lot, from fairly smart ones (most on offer from mills) to the more casual ones you find ready to wear.
The only other weave you haven’t mentioned is twill, but I don’t think you’d notice much difference between that and poplin, if you’re wearing trainers every day
Hi Simon,
I have always preferred twill weave shirts for business to pinpoints, poplins, etc. I think they drape better, are better at resisting wrinkles, and tend to be more opaque so it’s harder to see an undershirt, or anything else, underneath them.
You put the plain blue poplin as your number 1 shirt. Do you disagree with my opinions on twill vs the other weaves? Why do you prefer a poplin to twill?
Hi Jeff,
A twill is great in that regard – it’s denser in the weave normally, which gives if all those benefits.
I’d say it’s just as useful as a poplin. The only reason I put poplin as the number one is that some people don’t like that heaviness of a twill
It’s definitely heavier, and despite living in Texas where it is hot, it doesn’t bother me at all. I guess I’m one of those people that runs cold, skinny arms and legs. I’m also the guy that wears an 11 oz serge twill 3 piece year round too though. I’ve tried to like poplin, but despite paying for “better quality” (I.e. higher priced) poplin shirts, the properties that I don’t like about it are the same.
Ah, in that case it would suit you very well Jeff, yes.
On shirt qualities, when you get something more expensive, most of the time it just means finer cotton, which isn’t necessarily better. See the article on superfine shirting here for detail on that.
I recently acquired a mid blue denim shirt but in dress shirt details so no pocket / contrast stitching etc and found it quite difficult to style with. It is a bit too dark to pair with navy suit and found it looks a bit “cheap” when combines with dark jeans. Do you mind giving me some suggestions?
Denim can be quite hard in that way – the shade makes a big difference.
Usually, the issue is the colour of the denim is stronger, or more saturated than a normal business-type shirt.
Try wearing it with more casual and strong colours such as deep or strong greens and browns. And cream can be nice too.
Along this line, would you say the PS lightweight denim and everyday denim are the same shade? Or is one different than the other.
They are not different weights – they are different shades. ‘Lighter’ means a lighter colour.
See this post for the two shown together.
There is also a comparison picture on the shop page here.
Would black jeans / drawstring black linen pants work just as well?
To be honest, I don’t own either and they’re not things I wear that much, so I’m not sure. But my instinct is that they wouldn’t work that well, no.
Does it matter what type of single cuff one chooses (barrel/mitered/square with one or two buttons) or is it just a matter of taste?
Mostly taste – it’s a small point. The difference between a single and double cuff (as well as cloth, colour, pattern etc) is much greater.
I think you’ll probably find over time you tend towards simplicity, which normally means a single button for instance.
Hi Simon,
I have a collar related question. I’m looking to have a couple of Oxford shirts made up and I’ve generally followed your advice and gone for button downs for my less formal shirts – worn without tie the high collar looks great given I’m quite tall with long neck.
Having said that I think having 5 button down informal oxford style shirts might be overkill – on a sliding scale of formality are there other types of collar you’d go for – my work shirts are all cutaway but would like something that stands up as much as possible.
Any recommendations on collar types to go for with an informal Oxford that aren’t button downs? I just don’t know what to ask for
Thanks as always
Hey Harry
Sure. A point collar can look nice, and if it is a point rather than a cutaway, it will still look relatively casual. Have a look at the style of the Drake’s point collars, perhaps, and see if you like that as something to show your shirtmaker?
Hi Simon,
Wasn’t sure which article to post this under, but figured this is a good one. How do you feel about button down collars on poplin/broadcloth shirts that wouldn’t be worn with a tie? Looking more at something like a light blue/white bengal stripe for spring/summer. I figure plain white poplin may be a bit of a formality clash but the stripe could work?
Yes, I think that would be nice Jonny.
What is your opinion on (very) pale purple dress shirts?
They can be very nice, particularly with navy suit or tie, and dark grey. But much easier to wear as a stripe, rather than a solid.
And they’ll always be an unusual piece, one that drives a lot of what else you wear.
See a similar shirt, striped lilac, on me here.
How versatile are poplin shirts? I’d think that a relatively casual poplin (patterned, button-down-collar) might go with a relatively refined chino.
Poplin isn’t that casual really – it’s the standard smart-shirt material usually. More detail in the Guide to Shirt Fabric
Many thanks! Too smart even for linen, for a somewhat casual office environment (for example, linen trousers and a sports coat in spring/summer)? I know you’ve recommended cotton/linen mixed shirts for pairing with linen suits, but I’m trying to figure out just how much leeway there is in terms of the formality scale.
No, if you’re wearing tailored trousers and a sports jacket that would probably be fine
Do you prefer poplin or twill for your regular business shirts, Simon?
Is a twill shirt like the ones of Eton (signature twill shirts) wearable in the summer?
Thanks.
Generally poplin – twill is denser and heavier, but feels softer often, not as crisp.
There’s lots of information on the different in this article.
Hi Simon,
I’m thinking of ordering a few check shirts from Luca for more casual, family, things (once the world is back to normal) – I often feel as though my oxfords are about over the top for family meals etc. I wondered if you felt there were better materials for this type of shirt, and weather a button down is the right choice?
Thanks as always
A button down can certainly work well, as can a spread collar if it’s not too extreme. Brushed cottons are probably the nicest and most luxurious thing to have here, but if you want something more casual, just heavier cottons and thicker yarns are great. Unfortunately they don’t tend to be the kind of thing usually provided for bespoke makers
I like the nice high button downs should get a nice big roll..much prefer white or pearl buttons.for me Dean Martin wore the best ones. In the 60s they where much easier to find. Now they are mostly musical
Comedy versions.
If you’re interested, Dash, that sounds like the kind of shirt we sell on PS. Higher collar, great roll, and a cloth that specifically replicates old 50s Brooks Brothers oxford cloth.
You can see them here.
I would like to know how many cm (min to max) are usually added to the body measurements of chest, waist and hips to get the proper shirt measurements? That would be quite useful to know for MTM and when you spot a nice RTW shirt.
Do your shirt measurements vary between casual and dress shirts?
I find it’s actually a better metric to measure a shirt you like, rather than going off a standard excess like this. Because people do like things bigger or smaller.
If you want to know what to look for with an MTM shirt, look up our video on how a bespoke shirt should fit
Hi Simon,
I have a question about the shrinkage of Oxford cloth, having just bought a new shirt in it from a good maker.
I have heard it said that cotton has a nominal shrinkage ‘potential’ of around 5%, and how it is laundered (water temperature, mainly) determines how quickly, or even whether at all, that is reached.
Now, for a full shirt, I imagine that different parts shrink in different ways, depending on the exact weave, the construction and stitching between pieces, etc.
May I ask your experience with Oxford cloth shirts?
Should I expect the main measurements – chest, waist, sleeve and so on – of my new shirt, as yet unlaundered, all to shrink by about this amount? (I might add: the care tag suggests a 30-degree, delicate cycle.)
As it is, the shirt fits well and I worry that undue shrinkage could compromise that.
Thanks as always,
Jonathan
Hi Jonathan,
It’s impossible to tell I’m afraid. Cottons in general could shrink anywhere from 0% to 10% or even more, depending on the exact fibre, the yarn, the weave, the finishing etc etc. It’s impossible to generalise. Just look at jeans, from washed with no shrinkage to unsanforised with lots of it.
You can generalise a little with oxfords, but only a little. Here we know we’re dealing with cotton, and with a particular weave. But still, lots of other things vary. Old, slubby oxfords like I love will always shrink a bit – perhaps 4-6%. Fine, cleanly finished business ones will hardly shrink at all.
You really need to ask the manufacturer, and they really should know. If you wash it as they say, it should shrink the amount they say.
In terms of where the shrinkage happens, it only really varies with how much cloth there is, and the direction of the cloth. So you get the most shrinkage in the sleeve length and the body length, because those are the biggest expanses of material, and the material runs down both of them (rather than across)
I hope that helps a bit
Thank you, Simon. That helps.
The shirt is somewhat slubby in feel, but cleaner in look. My instinct is that it’ll go by less than 5% overall. I will just have to wash it (at 30…) and see.
Are there any makers who pre-shrink (wash) their cloth?
Jonathan
Yes, a lot do, but often it takes multiple washes to get all shrinkage out. Why not ask the maker?
They have confirmed: indeed about 5%.
Thanks for the help.
Jonathan
Oh good.
Hi Simon, have you had a shirt made with Thomas Mason Hampton 140/2 twill? if yes, what do you make of it? do you think that this is suitable for an everyday semi formal office wear (e.g. sometimes suits sometime an odd trouser and a sport jacket). Trying to find an alternative for poplin.
I haven’t I’m afraid. I’d imagine it will be good though, from the sounds of it
Hi Simon, thanks for creating this wonderful website! Such a useful resource. I was wondering if you can please suggest a specific fabric for a plain-blue poplin (formal shirt number 1). Thanks again.
Hey Ian,
There really isn’t much to tell between the good mills for a poplin like that. Just pick a shade you like from any good supplier – Thomas Mason, Canclini, Alumo etc.
Perhaps have a read of the guide to shirt fabrics if you want more detail
Hi Simon,
I’m trying to buy a casual MTM shirt for my dad as a present but he wears all the shirts untucked. I’m wondering what’s your view generally on untucked shirts and do you have any recommendations in terms of style, pattern and fabric?
Cheers,
Nick
Most of the time I think untucked shirts look sloppy and not that stylish. There are definite exceptions, such as a heavier flannel or overshirt, with a knit or tee underneath; and summer shirts such as aloha ones. But in both cases, the shirts are designed to worn untucked, and are different in weight and texture to a regular shirt.
Simon!
What is your opinion on party wear shorts?
I rarely wear jackets and so for night outs should I go with party wear shirts or normal Oxford button down would be your preference?
Interested what you consider a ‘party’ shirt Danish?
Something of a crisper material for ex poplin and dark in colour or a polka dot shirt or maybe a neutral colour shirt with colourful and bright patterns
I wouldn’t really wear any of those apart from a dark poplin I’m afraid.
I’d wear a jacket if I wanted to be smart, and an casual material (denim, pique) if I wanted to be casual. But patterns aren’t very elegant
If I want to have a slightly minimal shirt wardrobe – say 14-15, it seems like 5 blue shirts would be a good base? Besides a blue Oxford, blue chambray, blue end on end, and poplin, what else would you consider? These will mostly be for casual office where and with blazers and sport coats
If this is your whole wardrobe we’re talking about Benn, then I wouldn’t have a different material for every blue shirt.
I would keep it to two or three materials, and have variations like one with an unlined collar, to be more casual, or a smarter one with a double cuff for suits or blazers. Perhaps also one with a different style of collar, such as a strong cutaway or longer point.
Great point. In a collection of 15 of so shirts, is 5 blue solids shirts excessive? Thoughts if you were to expand your 5 shirt capsule collection?
No I don’t think that’s excessive. I think it’s the most versatile colour really. Hard to give more of a breakdown of shirts without more on personal taste, style circumstances. But if you have any specific questions then happy to answer
What is your opinion on more eye catching stripes like white or pink shirt with navy or dark grey stripes or something with slightly bolder patterns for casual wear? Do you find it elegant?
I was thinking it could be a nice visual interest in summer to an outfit when it is very difficult to layer.
Yes, that can be elegant in the summer, when the brightness and boldness is reflected in the weather.
Do you find Gingham shirts elegant?
I wouldn’t describe them as elegant most of the time, more sporty. Can look great though
Hi Simon! I recently commissioned a linen shirt thinking it would be a good alternative to Oxford shirts for summer as linen is casual fabric but though linen not as smart as cotton but was still smarter than store bought Oxford shirts. 1)Do you think it would become a lot more casual after a couple of washes?
2) Is it better to get casual shirts from off the rack rather than commisioning it because i have felt a serious gap with tailors in regard to casual shirts?
I don’t think it will become more casual, no. And yes, it’s definitely a gap with tailors – bear in mind they’re always aiming for a smarter, often business client
Indeed! And therefore I went with linen shirts because the fabric is inherently casual, but then too it is smarter then off the rack linen shirts.
Are store bought linen shirts also garment washed like Oxford shirts to make it look worn in?
Sometimes, yes. But it’s also a matter of using lighter weight linens, not as fine ones, and not using as much structure in the collars and cuffs, if any at all
Hey Simon! Love you content, and I’m a 20 year old trying to get into the world of ivy and quality clothes. Just wondering how do you like monograms on shirt? ie. Your initials. Perhaps your opinion may vary depend on formal shirts and oxfords too! And let’s say you do enjoy them, where on the shirt would you put the monogram? Thanks!
Hey Damien, nice to hear from you.
Personally I don’t like initials when they are public – something others see. It’s flashy and gauche, often a sign of a show-off when it comes to clothes. I have them on my shirts, but only on the bottom of the placket, where they are not seen.
You can have them on the body of the shirt, but only if you rarely take your jacket off. Otherwise (as with having them on your cuff) it just feels like you’re striving to tell everyone, all the time, that you have your shirts made.
Any other questions let me know. S
Haha cannot agree more. Cheers.
Hi Simon,
Do you have any recommendations for a summer counterpart to your PS Oxford button down shirts (white, light blue, and blue/white stripes)? Something that would be casual enough to go well with mid blue jeans by themselves, or maybe under linen overshirts?
Thanks
Hi John,
Good question, I’m not sure I do actually. A linen would be nice, but you want something with a little more substance than a smart linen shirt.
Have you looked at the linen/cotton ones Rubato has? Might be nice if the fit works for you
John.
J Crew have linen button downs. They wash well and appear to survive sun cream.
I have just moved back to london. Where would you recommend I get my shirts made?
My first question would be whether you like and have used English shirtmakers in the past, Richard, or more Italians. That’s the biggest difference between your choices (and the Italians are usually doing trunk shows)
Would a colour like Olive or darker green do justice to oxford shirts?
It can look OK as a colour, but I might prefer it in something like a baby cord
Would one need the 5 formal capsule collection shirts if he does not wear a suit or at most a smart jacket?
No, probably not
Simon,
I don’t know where to put this comment, but probably best here.
This article is very helpful, but perhaps a little (!) outdated given the
ongoing casualisation.
For example, I wouldn’t necessarily describe the average Oxford shirt as a casual shirt that I would wear regularly on weekends. The PS Oxford shirts are somewhat of an exception because of the great and slubby (if that is the correct word) material.
That said, it would be great if you could write an article about slightly more casual shirts than those mentioned above.
A good example would be the white Roper shirt from Rubato, if it didn’t have such a strong western influence. Perhaps a shirt like this without the western influence – and perhaps without the breast pockets – would also be a gap in the market for PS.
Kind regards
Markus
Thanks Markus, and yes you’re absolutely right. The PS Oxford falls in that category (correct word!) but most oxfords don’t.
Part of the issue with talking about casual shirts on here is that most materials for them are not available to have made bespoke, so you’re almost highlighting individual shirts rather than materials. Eg a western shirt you can talk about, but the other Rubato work shirts are great but you don’t get the same materials elsewhere much.
I guess it would be a case of talkina about styles (button down, work shirt, denim shirt, western shirt, flannel shirt) rather than materials
Thank you, Simon. I see.
I’m lucky that your Oxford shirts -and the other Luca Avitabile shirts – fit me perfectly, as my tailor has confirmed (I have five of yours now), so I think I’ll simply stick with them.
My only purchase from Rubato so far has been the cream work shirt. Nice material, but extremely baggy even in small. I use it as an overshirt.
Oh good, nice to hear.
On the Rubato, maybe try having the body slimmer. It’s quite an easy alteration to do
What type of collar do you wear most often nowadays? And what’s the other one you wear next?
I wear most often a button down or a point.
Hi Simon, what do you think about a twill button down with jeans and a wool jacket? Is this too much of a clash of formality levels?
And the second question would be how a button down twill or popelin will work with trousers. Always no tie. I thought about getting a twill button down do bridge both levels without a tie.
I’d avoid it to be honest Max. Why not a casual oxford instead?
Thank you Simon for your fast response! Ok and ignoring jeans, would you use a button down collar in a dress shirt like twill or popelin?
Or all your dress/business shirts have a pinpoint or spread collar?
They’re all point or spread, but a button down is OK in a smarter material, just not too smart
I want to add an example. High Twist Trousers, Button-Down Twill, navy hopsack. No Tie. Am I aiming right on the formality levels? 🙂
Yes that would be fine Max
I always go for spread collar and a single cuff for my dress shirts. But a double cuff? I’ve never worn a dress shirt with a double cuff. If I am not mistaken a double cuff is more formal than a single cuff no? Therefore it’s not recommended to wear such shirt with linen and high-twist wool suits, correct me if I am wrong. So perhaps I’ll get a button-down oxford because I think it’s so versatile or is it still fine to get a shirt with a double cuff in my case?
A double cuff is more formal, yes. Fine with a high-twist wool suit though. The bigger issue today is just that they’re so rare they’re more likely to stand out.
If in doubt I’d go for a spread collar and single cuff. That’s a fairly smart shirt; a button-down oxford would be rather more casual
Thank you for the explanation Simon.