B&Tailor double-breasted overcoat: Review
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We covered the Korean outfit B&Tailor in some detail here at the beginning of the month. For details on them, their history and their style, please read that article.
It might seem a little odd splitting things up like this, but I find it makes for a more functional archive. New commissions get their own piece - branching off from the original background article - and it creates a well-structured, consistent resource. As with everything else on PS, the hope is it will be useful for many years to come.
Now, on with the review.
There was a moment when I picked up this coat on the morning of my last day in Korea last year. I slipped it on, buttoned it up, and a smile spread across my face.
“I could see immediately you liked it, it was such a relief!” Sam Ahn told me later (the cloth agent who had helped organise the trip).
It was true. I did, I really did. It felt easy and comfortable, yet elegant and stylish. The line of the lapels and the silhouette were flattering. When I popped the collar it sat perfectly - framing the face and not collapsing outwards or poking the chin. Just perfect.
It was satisfying, as clothes made very well for you often are. It was exciting, as I was immediately looking forward to wearing it. And it was a relief, as the whole thing had been done in a week and it had seemed uncertain how it would turn out.
That was all contained in that smile.
The impression has only deepened since. The coat is cut quite wide in the shoulders - definitely the width to go over a B&Tailor already-wide-shouldered jacket - but it doesn’t feel too big. (There always a balance there, cutting it for different things worn underneath, as discussed here.)
Perhaps that impression will mellow. There is always a bit of an afterglow with a commission that has worked out well, and right now this seems perfect. Although, I have been wearing it since December and haven’t changed my view on anything, except that I mildly prefer the Fox cloth used here to this one.
I wore the coat most days at Pitti back in January - on the plane, carefully folded in the rack above; walking during the day, often folded over my arm; and in the evening wrapped up tightly against the cold.
That also meant wearing it with a range of outfits. Over a suit and tie, over a jacket and flannels, and over a knit and jeans. It did well with all of them.
In our recent article on Cifonelli there was some discussion about wearing a navy double-breasted coat casually, for example with jeans.
This is definitely harder to do than one with in a more casual colour, pattern, material, style and breast number. A single-breasted, raglan, tweedy, brownish herringbone would be easier and more versatile.
Although all these attributes don’t necessarily have the same effect - a navy single-breasted coat is arguably a worse match. There’s something about a DB that ups the ante, that makes it more of a deliberate style, and easier to wear with in a more contrasting way as a result.
But in any case, all we’re saying with that list is that those various attributes make a coat more versatile with casual clothing - not that they’re the only option. If you’re buying just one good coat, versatility should be a big factor. But if you have more than one to play with, a navy DB with jeans can be great - as here, with light-blue denim, then all navy and black elsewhere, simple and tonal.
(We’ll cover black shoes with jeans in another post, otherwise this one will get too far off topic.)
In the context of our recent series analysing overcoats, it’s interesting how simply the B&Tailor is made. There are no pleats in the back, unlike Ciardi, Liverano or Cifonelli; there’s just a central seam, running down into a pleat beneath the belt.
But there’s still a lot of excess material in the back, gathered into that belt, as you can see in the various images. This really makes the back look dramatic (it helps that it’s cut larger anyway, as with the shoulders). The fact the belt is wider (8cm compared to 6-7cm on the others) also gives it a little character.
I can see quite a few readers preferring more styling elements, like a central box pleat, side pleats, buttons on the belt and a buttoned vent (all of which B&Tailor can do). But I also like this simpler direction; certainly, I would stop short of buttons on the belt, which seems to be the point where it becomes overkill. A bit menswear 2010.
The make on the coat in general is very good. You can see how precise the buttonholes are in the images above, and as we talked about in our recent piece on Korean tailoring generally, that’s something that has really improved in the past decade.
The top stitching on the edges is neat, the lining inside is finished well, and there are nice details like the tiny tack stitch on the turn-back cuff. It’s pretty much the level of English tailors and better than most Neapolitans.
The cloth is CT10, a Fox Brothers merino overcoating weighing 24/25oz. I really like the weight, but marginally prefer the set (density) of the CT12 I used for my Ettore coat. Because that’s a tad looser, you see more of the herringbone and the flannel finish is a little less fluffy. The downside is that CT12 is lighter at 20/21oz.
I should make clear, by the way, that I would in no way suggest a reader should have so many DB navy coats! I went for one here because I thought it would best suit the style I liked from B&Tailor, which its mix of vintage and modern formality. And covering the tailor the best way is always the priority when covering a first commission on PS.
I’ve included a few pictures here of the two fittings I had in Seoul with Chad Park of B&Tailor and his father.
Both of these went very smoothly, and I particularly liked the way Chad used the yellow guide (above) to show me where the peak lapel would sit. I’ve come a cropper in the past trying to imagine that with just some faint chalk.
On the basis of this experience I can only highly recommend Chad and B&Tailor, and it’s great to put to bed issues they had in Europe in the past. I only wish they visited the UK for trunk shows (it’s currently only New York, Beijing and Singapore).
Perhaps if this goes down well enough we can convince them.
Outfit details for the checked jacket are as seen on this article. The jeans are vintage Levi's, the knit and belt from Rubato.
Bespoke details:
- Suits start at 4,000,000 KRW (£2360) in Seoul, my coat was 5,720,000
- Abroad, prices are set by the partner retailers - in New York (Notice of Appearance), Beijing (Principle M) and Singapore (Last & Lapel).
- Bespoke suit price in New York is $3800. The coat would have been $4500
MTM details:
- Suits start at 2,800,000 KRW (£1655) in Seoul
- Abroad, prices are set by the partner retailers, as above.
- MTM suit price in New York is $2800
- Made to measure isn’t fully hand made, but is still done in Korea to the same style as the bespoke. It is also offered in the partner shops outside of trunk shows
That is one heck of a beautiful coat and probably the one that I like most and the style and colour that I would begin with.
You can’t go wrong with Fox cloth.
I particularly like the modest lapels where on other creations,I see great Broad sweeping lapels, nearly overdone in width and even too high.
What, if any British tailor could you recommend for a coat like this for price albeit if the style is somewhat different.
Me thinks W&S, Hitchcock or A&S, unless there are others.
This is a beautiful review and I’m delighted that you like this coat.
It certainly does awaken the Overcoat itch I thought I kicked a long time ago.
It is beautifully made and the styling seems easy enough. I just might be convinced to get back into them, after I swore off them in favour of Barbours.
But let’s see how your future report on it goes first!
A sleek,unfussy coat with subtle attention to detail. Would you say it is a little longer? Not that this is a bad thing. I think the proportions are superb.
Yes, I think it’s about an inch longer than others I’ve had, even than the Liverano. Not entirely sure about it, but not a big difference or a hard thing to change
That is a beautiful coat for a competitive price.
Just one remark. In one of the pictures there is a sign „Made in Italy“. This is somewhat confusing as the coat was solely made in Korea, I presume.
That’s just where the mannequin was made
That is a very beautiful coat.
Re wearing a DB more casually one thing I always find is with the shallower V I always feel like there needs to be something more to fill in the gap. It’s a problem I have with wearing my peacoat without a scarf or polo neck.
Yes I think I see what you mean Aaron. Depends a bit on body shape as well. Turning up the collar or adding a scarf works well if you prefer something there
A nice DB coat like this one (or perhaps something like a polo coat) is an itch in my mind for quite some time now! It’s just a very versatile piece and always looks flattering. Ghiaia does also show some nice examples of how a DB Coat in navy or camel can be styled very casually but still giving the outfit something like a little gravitas.
This example is certainly very very nice and well made. I like it as much as the Ettore Coat. Can’t have enough navy DB coats;)
Nice point Amon on Ghiaia, yes. If anyone didn’t see my interview with them, it’s here
„I would stop short of buttons on the belt.“ I am sorry, I don’t understand. You say buttons on the belt are gimmicky?
I’m saying having all those things – the box pleat in the back, the side pleats, the buttoned belt, the buttoned vent – can be a bit too much
Thanks!
But isn’t there a functional benefit of having buttons on a coat belt, allowing the coat to be adjusted to suit what is being worn underneath? ie, loose for a jacket or snug fot a sweater?
Not usually. Normally it’s just for show – the two flaps can be undone, unbuttoned, but there aren’t multiple buttons for them to attach to, only one set.
If it is adjustable then you have a second button showing on one side when the belt is on the looser setting
Yes, that’s what I meant
I see. Yes most aren’t made like that. I did have it once – on my Vergallo coat here. But in the same way as buttoning up to the chin, I found it was something I didn’t really get that much benefit from, and was more just excited about because it seemed like a neat idea.
Hi Simon,
Did you go with a herringbone pattern to keep it slightly more casual and thus, versatile?
I’m keen on getting my first navy overcoat but think I would stick with a plain navy, even if that means it won’t work with jeans, I would think tailored flannels would still be fine.
Thank you!
With this coat you can’t really see the herringbone, it’s essentially just plain. A herringbone would make it a little more casual, but it’s about the yarn too – a fine or shiny yarn in a herringbone weave is still going to look smart.
If you want plain navy, just look for something with a little more texture or roughness in the material
Ahh I see.
I mainly plan to wear with tailoring (odd jacket and flannels) so I guess it is OK if it is a smarter fabric, correct?
Thank you!
Yes absolutely
looking forward to the article with jeans and black shoes even you mentioned it partial in some post i appriciat very much.
for me i am decide like this: if the jeans are navy black works even boots, if jeans are brigter (light blue, ecru) than i keep i mint to make the top also very dark, like in your example the overcoat with the black loafers. A loafer in any case is easiest to pull of because its not using that much space like a boot for example 🙂
Hi Simon,.
I have read your blog for a while and seen many pictures of you in various coats.
To me, everything in this coat seems great, however too me you look taller and thinner than usual.
Why that is I have no clue… Perhaps you do? Or is it only my eyes that noticed this?
I really liked this coat anyhow and will hopefully soon commission something not to different.
Three questions on that;
1) Comparing this fabric with your Ettore De Cesare, which one would you consider more casual? Do you have any recommendation for a navy casual overcoat fabric? I live in Stockholm.
2) What do you think would be the difference without the waistband, would it work? For my own up-coming commission I would like to keep it quite casual so I can wear it with jeans and converse easy.
3) Is it possible to put a button on your right shoulder, so you can “wrap” the lapels and close the coat tighter to your neck on such a model? Or does that require other lapes?
On my own future commission I would go for jetted pockets and cuffs with a strap like often found on raglans. Any thoughts on that is welcome.
Thank you for a great blog & post! Would love to go to Zeoul, however going there 3 times just seems to complicated and expensive for a european.
Regards,
Daniel
Hi Daniel,
Thank you, and that’s an interesting observation. I would guess it has to do with the length of the coat, and the proportions of the lapels. Great tailoring can certainly have that effect through its use of these proportions, so lovely to hear that it does, at least to you.
1) Perhaps the Ettore fabric, it is a tiny bit more tweedy.
2) I don’t think the belt makes it that much smarter – in fact it might be cleaner and so look smarter without it possibly. I’d leave it.
If you want to wear it like that, I might consider other colours though, eg brown or grey, unless you also want it to be smart, with tailoring etc.
3) It isn’t possible on this model, but I have had it in the past (eg on my Cifonelli) and to be honest I found I rarely used it. And it means the button orientation has to change. I wouldn’t do it myself – use it as an excuse to wear a nice scarf instead.
With regard to point 3, would you also do without that feature today, were you to commission a new pea coat?
No, for a pea coat I would keep that feature, because that’s the pea coat style – the two runs of buttons and fastening all the way up. It’s a different style to an overcoat like this
per me è un po’ troppo lungo. il problema è che in Italia non esiste più l’inverno, fa troppo caldo!, e rischi non indossare mai cappotti così “caldi”
Yes Marco, I can imagine in Italy it must be hard to wear coats like this. My friends in Naples tend to have coats that are jacket-weight, shorter, unlined, and wear them as soon as it’s even slightly cold, so they get to wear them at least a month or two of the year. They’re rarely actually needed
Hi Simon. As things warm up in the UK, if you were working in a formal city office, typically wearing a separate jacket and trousers or suit, and the weather was too cold in the morning for no coat, too warm for the featured coat, and no risk of rain, what style of coat would you choose?
I’d wear a top coat – a lighter wool (perhaps 16-20oz) and single breasted. My Michael Browne coat is stylised, but an example of that type.
Other options for this kind of weather are a shorter coat like the Wax Walker we do, or a Barbour style. And also things like knits under the jacket, and scarf
Great coat. Proportions and silhouette all pretty spot on. The vents are cut in a way that there’s less flare at the bottom (or is that just due to the stance?), which makes the shoulders and back look wider. I like the minimalist styling, esp. for a navy DB. I’d raise the gorge and widen lapels a bit though.
Thanks Ben, and yes I think the skirt is quite neat. The lower gorge (and necessarily slightly slimmer lapels, being lower) is a bit more the B&Tailor style, which is quite vintage-influenced
Simon,
I have been wondering why suede is rather an unpopular material in making overcoats, by which I mena. While it seems a staple for shirt-jackets and bomber (valstrino), it never holds much significance in the MTW world of menswear whenever it comes to longer coats like pea coat,or the double coat. Is there an intrinsic conflict between the material of suede and the overcoat style in general, that suede should be treated in the casual realm of leather jackets rather than the more classical category of overcoat?
Yes, I think when you have suede at that kind of scale, it can be quite a strong statement. It’s also not as smart, and is a little more delicate.
They can look fantastic, and I actually have an old Ralph one, but it’s not an everyday piece
Well, to be honest, the idea of having a suede overcoat came to me just because of the cover of 1966 bob dylan album blonde on blonde, so i guess it is indeed more of a statement piece for me from the very beginning.
In addition, I wonder if you would offer more information about your Ralph piece? I acquired a ralph lauren double breasted suede coat on ebay 2 years ago, but the collar is very weird and I think it may not be among the classics.
Sure. Mine is more a trench coat style, double breasted with a collar in that manner, though without quite as many bells and whistles, like storm flaps and epaulettes. Happy to look at yours if you have an image.
For something like the Dylan look, I’d try and find an old vintage one, rather beaten up and not necessarily the highest quality
Is this the first you’ve used a spear point collar on the PS Oxford cloth? (Or are my eyes deceiving me.)
Either way, It plays really well with the proportions of the coat, picking up some of its nice angularity. It all feels very architectural, for lack of a better word.
Thank you.
It’s actually just a button-down, unbuttoned. Some people see this as a little affected, but I think if you’re outside the Instagram bubble, the only risk really is it can look a little messy. And it is a very effective way to get two collars in one!
More images of that, and you can see it better there, on this piece with the same outfit.
Hello Simon,
Where is that black belt from? I can’t find it on the rubato website.
Thank and kind regards
Simon
It’s no longer offered by them unfortunately
I do like the coat in its overall style. Length provides some drama but would be slightly beyond my personal preference. General question to cost in your articles: does it include cloth, or does it refer to the make, only?
Always with cloth
Lovely! Unfortunately, our southern weather doesn’t favor overcoats, aside from perhaps ten days per year. I do enjoy this series from afar, though.
Just so happens I will be landing in London on the 23rd. I will try to make it over to your pop-up in the late afternoon. (The vagaries of customs and hotel check-in make landing day timing hard to calculate.) If I do, I won’t be hard to recognize—if I had to guess, I’ll be the only one there with a southern accent.
Ha! Love it, I’ll wait for you to say hello then Jack. Look forward to it if you can make it
Lovely coat. Simon, what are the loafers worn with the vintage levi’s?
They’re vintage Ralph Lauren ones, bought on eBay. Alligator, quite 80s, very low vamp Italian
https://us.corekore.com/product/zb192russian-reindeer-calf/382/category/71/display/1/
Any idea on what this style is called
Well, a one-eyelet derby with a hand-sewn apron. Not sure there’s a definite name, it’s pretty unusual!
Sure it really did stand out, for you to say it’s unusual means it really must be.
Asian tailoring seems to be doing exciting things. I love your WW chan jacket also. Can you speak to whether WW chan or The Anthology is the ‘better’ bespoke maker. I have narrowed it down to those two as I visit Hong Kong semi regularly and would like to begin building a wardrobe with one suit and one blazer to begin with. Thanks Simon.
I wouldn’t say either is better necessarily, I would pick largely on style. Sorry, I know that’s not necessarily helpful!
wwchan is obviously a better maker, look at the pad stitching for both, Anthology lapel tend to curve up especially with their double breasted suit. The trousers also set both maker apart dramatically, anthology tend to cut their trousers fuller than chan’s this makes the garment look straight with less ironing work.
What a lovely coat! Thanks for sharing your experience–it’s good to see that it never gets old for you, and that great tailoring still brings you a smile. One day you should write a post about how you nurture your passion for yourself (and not for your audience), and how not to let it burn out, though I’m sure there must be some struggle with this given how all-consuming it must be.
Thanks Paul, and yes good point, that would be a nice post some time. It helps a lot if you carry on loving clothing, wearing it and exploring new things people do. If you don’t it just becomes a business, which is a shame
Hi Simon,
Have you written an article before exploring the dynamics of the business relationship between tailor shops and fabric mills/merchants?
I recently ordered my first bespoke suit and, in preparation, conducted some research on fabrics to have a starting point for our discussion. However, upon reaching the tailor shop, I found that none of the mills, merchants, or swatches I had previously looked into were available. This trend was consistent when I visited other tailors, including some you have worked with in the past. I didn’t expect to see niche names such as Maison Hellard but I was shocked not to see bigger players such as VBC, Harrisons etc.
Is there a specific reason for this? Perhaps issues like narrow profit margins, unfavorable terms, import/export costs, or could there be another underlying factor?
Additionally, I’ve noticed a discrepancy in the online visibility of fabric bunches, ex. Solbiati bunches are nearly impossible to view compared to Drapers. Could this be attributed to a focus on B2B sales with bespoke customers as a secondary consideration?
Hey Chris,
I haven’t, but it’s an interesting area.
The reason you won’t see every bunch with every tailor, is that it costs something for the mill to send out and update bunches, and it’s far more economic to have a smaller number of better customers. Plus, the tailors often consider that their view on which cloth is an important one, which is valid.
Also, VBC is not really a merchant, it doesn’t supply bunches usually – it uses its merchant Drapers to do that. It’s just the mill.
Lastly, yes most mills and merchants only do B2B, and historically it’s what everyone did. Only some now are doing B2C. It’s quite a fractured market essentially, with different business approaches going on.
Hi Simon,
This is a lovely coat indeed!
By the way, were the outfit worn at Pitti – the coat over the knit and jeans – your take on high-low dressing? It looks good, anyway.
John
I hadn’t thought about that John. I’m not sure I would consider that high/low – the contrast isn’t high enough. It would be more like that if I wear wearing chunky trainers or something
Beautiful coat!
It would be nice at some point to have a piece on Park Jeongyeol, Chad’s father. I think he’s always had great style!
Yes, very true David!
Another beautiful coat Simon. Given your recent review of your Cifonelli cashmere coat and how it is loosing its shape somewhat over time. Are there Loro Piana overcoat bunches that you like that are 100% wool or preferably with a cashmere mix. Apart from Fox are there any other fabric brands you like for a proper winter coat. Thanks.
I haven’t looked at the Loro Piana for a while, but yes absolutely there are great overcoat bunches elsewhere. I’d particularly recommend Holland & Sherry and Harrisons, as well as Lumb’s Golden Bale
Thank you Simon. Enjoy your weekend. Almost Spring!!
I love your vision of the perfect navy overcoat, Simon. It pairs effortlessly with faded denim. Two classics, each enhancing the other.
How amazing B&Tailor did two fittings and finished it in one week! I reckon you’re their best advertisement now.
Thank you, and pleased you think the style works so well
Outfit with jeans, watch cap, and alligator loafers is very chic, Simon. It could be in a French movie. 🙂
Thanks Cormac
Hi Simon,
For Bespoke overcoat, are they full canvas as well? my tailor suggested me that half canvas is enough for overcoat?
Thanks,
Larry
A bespoke overcoat is always full canvas Larry, and I would always have that. Even on a lightweight summer jacket I would always have full canvas – just make the canvas lighter
Hi Simon, thanks for helping me to construct linen and fresco suits for someone who lives in a tropical country like me. It is indeed makes sense that I don’t know how to design a coat since for obvious reason we don’t need it here.
And this is the look of a coat I want, I am definitely going to get a bespoke double breasted overcoat, probably in charcoal grey wool herringbone with ticket pocket. This should be the only coat that I have just in case I travel to Europe during winter someday (also makes sense that I can’t stand the cold, it’s always 28C+ where I live. I am so used to the heat)
Two questions though regarding this:
I also don’t know whether it’s appropriate to wear chelsea boots, probably in dark brown suede with thin rubber sole. Or perhaps is there any colour and shoes you could suggest to get to be worn with this overcoat? A black leather captoe oxford would be more appropriate of course. Thanks in advance.
Also love the look of your outfit with jeans in one of your photos here.
Hi Iqbal,
Sounds nice. If you’re in any doubt about the ticket pocket, I’d go without, just because it’s the kind of feature that can seem exciting at the time, but which you regret later. Not a big deal though.
On the length, you should err shorter, but I would still go a little below the knee, as it’s easy to shorten later.
For suits underneath, almost any smartish colour. Navy, grey, charcoal, dark brown. Checks and stripes.
It is probably the smartest of the overcoat colours you could go with, and that would limit the shoes a little bit. But still, that boot would be fine if worn with smarter trousers and a knit perhaps.
Thank you, like 2cm below the knee perhaps? And yeah, probably a black suede chelsea boots with thin rubber sole would be a wiser choice instead of dark brown suede. I simply like the colour of charcoal, especially with double breasted overcoat. I am thinking to wear this overcoat with suit, dress shirt, no tie again, but this time with scarf (probably in burgundy to match the gloves) I rarely wear tie, I always go for open neck look simply because it makes more sense that I live in a tropical country.
Thanks, and sounds good