Bryceland’s: Sawtooth shirt review and range overview
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One of the most enjoyable things about having Ethan in the pop-up shop last month was the opportunity to try on the full Bryceland’s range.
Ethan was pretty popular with readers during the day, but there would normally be half an hour before we opened - or perhaps in the early afternoon - where I could try stuff on and quiz him about it.
Some of the pieces were a little traditional in their stye for me, but every one had the same thoroughness of thought and quality of materials that we now associate with Bryceland’s.
I’ll start, however, with the Sawtooth Westerner shirt (pictured above), as it’s the one piece I’ve had for a while and worn regularly.
Designed after a vintage piece (as most Bryceland’s things are), the Sawtooth is a heavy denim shirt with western details and long fronts and tails.
The latter detail is a vintage one, but also one that makes the shirt most interesting to fans of tailoring - as it makes the shirt much easier to keep tucked in to a pair of trousers.
The collar is a little low to comfortably sit above tailoring jackets, but it can be folded a little higher on the neck to make this easier, and it has a relatively trim fit, which again helps under tailoring.
I’m wearing a 38 in the images here, which is just about OK on the shoulders, and a nice fit through the waist. The 40 is perhaps better on the shoulders, but a little bulky in the waist.
The first thing you notice about the Sawtooth, though, is how stiff it is. It’s simply uncomfortable the first time you wear it.
But after 2 or 3 washes and wears, it softens markedly, and only feels nicer and softer over time - as well as starting to fade nicely at the edges and seams.
The process is similar to wearing in raw-denim jeans, which will often feel nicer than pre-washed models over years. A denim that starts stiff like that creases more sharply, creating edges that take more abrasion and expose the white core of the yarn, and leaving the lows deeper and darker.
Mine, pictured, has probably been washed and worn 10-12 times. Ethan’s, which he wears twice a week and never bothers to iron - just machine washing and drying - is even better, and had several customers in the pop-up asking if they could buy it.
Interestingly, however, Ethan was keen to produce a shirt that reflects the wearer - how they wear it and wash it - rather than a denimhead's ultimate cloth.
So while the denim comes from a small family-owned mill in Okayama, it is deliberately one without a lot of slubbiness or streaking - often things denim obsessives like - and rather something easy to use and wear.
As Ethan puts it: "The easy care, rugged and no nonsense nature of our cloth choices tends to extend across everything we make. We favour cloth that will age dependant on how it is worn, that is easily washed and dried, and that will get better with age.
"I find myself choosing camel hair or shetland wools over cashmere, oxford cloths over poplins, cordovan over french calf. Our casual range is almost exclusively made in Japan with Japanese woven cloth in weights that err towards the heavier side for durability."
Frankly, at this point the Sawtooth is one of my favourite things to wear with more casual clothing. It feels incredibly familiar, fits well, and is vintage-styled without being over the top.
It’s interesting to compare it to some of the other Bryceland’s shirts, which while I admire for the make, are too stylised for my taste. The Cabana shirt and Rayon shirt both have lovely details, like the thin band-like cuffs, but have a collar that’s too big for me.
And I was interested in the black version of the Sawtooth (a tribute to ‘The Man in Black’, Johnny Cash) but black would be too hard to fit into the rest of my wardrobe - given it largely consists of brown shoes and other warm tones of classic menswear.
If the fit works for you, though, the more sartorial tab-collar and button-down Bryceland’s shirts are nice. And indeed I really liked the styling of the USN chambray shirt - the fit just didn't work.
(Fit matters rather less in a heavy shirt like the Sawtooth, as it’s never going to have a clean drape in any fit, and shows tightness less too.)
Probably my favourite piece I bought during the pop-up was Bryceland’s RAF Rollneck Pullover (above).
This is a deceptive piece. It looks simple: a normal lambswool rollneck, made in Scotland. But the body shape is a vintage one, with a very narrow waist and tall rib.
That rib is super stretchy. Somehow it manages to be a close fit on me, enlarging into a big, flattering chest and shoulders, yet still fits someone like Ethan.
It’s the only fit of sweater I’ve ever found that is nice and trim through the waist, yet roomy at the top, and has enough material to not ride up when you move. The perfect combination.
Of course other vintage-inspired brands have done this cut - I used to have a striped one from North Sea Clothing. But those are usually in heavier, coarser wools, and frankly are only useable as outerwear.
The other pieces I wanted to try at the pop-up, and hadn’t done before, were the Chore Coat and Type 1 denim jacket (above).
The Chore Coat I was interested to wear over tailoring. But while the material was great (both white herringbone and jelt denim - a crisp, lightweight denim with natural slubbiness) the fit was too A-line for me.
The Type 1 jacket I would wear over a shirt, as a mid-layer under a coat. This was rather short in the body, and apparently gets shorter when washed. It was therefore marginal whether it would work on me given my height.
But I tried it with higher waisted trousers and the length was OK, so that became my second purchase. I was also taken (as I should have expected) by the exclusive iron buttons, which are designed to rust slightly over time.
![](https://www.permanentstyle.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/DSC07874-494x700.jpg)
Elsewhere, the Army Chinos I found too oversized in the leg, and a very high rise (just under the ribs). Equally the Gurkha Shorts.
The Denim 133 jeans are less extreme than the chinos - high but not so high, pretty straight in the leg - but I couldn’t justify getting any more jeans.
And in the pictures of myself wearing the Sawtooth shirt, I'm also wearing a Lee Kung Man undershirt: a Hong Kong brand that Bryceland’s carries.
That I’ve found to be great, its idiosyncrasy being that it is very tight on the arm and armpit when you first put it on - but this actually stops it moving around at all, making it very comfortable as underwear.
Lastly, I’ve tried the Bryceland’s boxer shorts, which are fantastically made (have a look at the overlapping tabs on the waistband at the back) but have a high rise that I find only works with equally high-rise trousers.
Bryceland's tends to do small runs of products, and individual sizes are sometimes out of stock. Instagram is usually the best place to see what's coming back into stock - although some things, like the Sawtooth and the Denim 133 jeans, aren't usually unavailable for long.
In the pictures of me I am also wearing:
- Tweed jacket from Ciro Zizolfi, in Holland & Sherry Harris Tweed (15/16oz, 892017)
- Heavy cotton-drill trousers from Whitcomb & Shaftesbury, in Fox Brothers khakee cotton twill (18/19oz, COT002 HV0002/11)
- Dark-Oak Shannon boots from Edward Green
- Cream cashmere handkerchief from Anderson & Sheppard
Photography: Jamie Ferguson @jkf_man except those in the pop-up, Buzz Tang.
For background on Bryceland's Co, read about my visit to them in Japan here.
![](https://www.permanentstyle.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/03/willy-in-brycelands-denim-487x700.jpg)
I really like these reviews where I can hear your take on brands. Especially when they are not easily accessible such as Bryceland.
By the way, speaking about accessibility (albeit slightly off topic): what do you think about the range of Adret in terms of style, quality and design? Will there be a coverage soon?
I am especially interested in the olive-brown suede cap, which seems to have a very interesting design. It seems like the brim isn’t attached to the top as usual with these kind of caps, making the cap nicely manipulatable. It could either be worn flat looking like a traditional flat cap, or pulln by the brim towards the face, heightening the “crown” and almost looking like a cap – at least from what I saw on Instagram.
Hi.
Thanks, and yes there will be a full, similar piece on Adret. It may be a few weeks, though, as I don’t want to write about it all before Adam and Seto have a chance to get the website sorted and have product available.
The cap is nice. The style didn’t work on me, but the thick suede is great as is the colour range. The peak isn’t attached to the body, and can be snapped up or down, though it’s cleaner when down.
I have been looking for this Shirt, but can‘t find it. Can you link me to a shop where it’s still available
Yes, it’s on the Bryceland’s site, under Shop > Clothing > Shirts then on page 2.
Or here: http://www.brycelandsco.com/shirts/products/bryceland-s-sawtooth-westerner-denim
Hi Simon,
Are the buttons on the sawtooth shirt mother of pearl?
Regards,
Pyc
I have a Lee Kung Man undershirt which I got from Bryceland on a trip to Tokyo 2 years ago. It’s really light weight and I hardly notice it once it’s on. I highly recommend them. They seem impossible to find anywhere else.
Hi Simon,
I know it’s not a question thats related to your last post but I just need your opinion in this inquire. I’m about to go for a four season dark navy suit. And I want a fabric thats strenght for everyday use. (I’m not going to wear the suit every single day of the week, but you know what I mean). And I’m about to choose the fresco fabric from huddersfield. Is that a bad choice for a four season suit of use? It’s around 300 grams.
Well, there will always be some kind of compromise with a four-season suit. No material is going to be perfect for both hot summer and cold winter.
Fresco is more of a warm-weather fabric, being designed to keep a crisp line yet let air permeate. It will be fairly hard-wearing, which sounds like a priority for you, but you might find it pretty chilly in the winter.
If you want the same effect in something better for the cold, get a heavier version or something like VBC’s 4-ply, available through Drapers.
Thank you for sharing your point of view Simon. I will have that in mind, great article as always. Cheers!
simon, great writeup as usual, thanks. i wonder how you wash the westerner sawtooth, though. cold wash? how about shrinkage here with qashing? i reckon the shirt is sandorized, but wouldnt there be shrinking nevertheless?
Hey Marcus,
Actually, as Ethan mentions in the piece, you can wash it (on cold if you prefer) in the machine and then tumble dry without any ill effects. It is sanforised, yes, and I haven’t had any shrinkage.
I got some shrinkage out of mine when I washed it hit (40 degrees). Probably around 2-3 cm in the sleeves.
This is is defenitely a shirt that gets better when washed. I prefer hot washes, to get all the shrinkage out and the fading becomes more even.
Did you buy it raw or washed to start?
Hi Simon,
In your opinion, how wide the leg opening should the shorts have?
I think that they look better when being slightly wider than trousers, would you agree?
It depends on your trousers of course, but yes shorts should often be a touch wider than them.
However, I tend to find most shorts either go far too wide or far too narrow. They’re hard enough for men to wear in the first place – they shouldn’t be over-styled. Get a nice average leg opening, and average just length just above the knee.
Have you considered being a stockist of some pieces from the sellers at your pop-ups?
Not really Joel – they all have their own online retail already. I wouldn’t really offer anything different?
Cheaper postage, quicker delivery for the customer in England and probably Europe. More income for you.
I don’t think you’ve ever run a shop Joel!.. It’s not much of a business case to take on a big stock risk merely with the selling point of proximity. You need more than that. It’s why the PS products are nearly all exclusive
Never.
Dear Simon,
Your fashion evolution grows from love of denim cloth to cowboy cut. The term “Western” is correct nevertheless tricky. Midwesterners (Chicago) would remind you that Western actually means Cowboy. Johnny Cash dressed “Western” but wasn’t a cowboy, but a well-dressed “Hillbilly” (Ozarks).
The rollneck is interesting. Do you have a photo of someone—anyone—wearing it? Can’t find it via google or on BL’s insta.
Buzz and Willy from The Anthology have them, as does Jerry from Prologue I think. I haven’t seen images of them without a jacket on though. Ethan took one of me which I’ll get at some point
I’ve been wearing a Bryceland’s Type1 denim jacket since November. It is indeed quite short, and I think mostly works well with high-waisted trousers. While I’m sure they will eventually, the iron buttons have not yet rusted at all, even in damp Seattle.
Not sure a JLC fits this outfit.
Yeah, I can see that. My GMT might have been better
Do you expect any seasonal limits to wearing your 18/19oz cotton trousers? Did you have to wear in those as well? Thanks
No, they don’t need wearing in… But yes, they’re not wearable for 3 or 4 months in the summer. They’re not the most versatile trouser from that point of view, or the first one anyone should buy.
Dear Mr. Crompton,
As I am sure you are aware, a certain tradition known as ‘trashing’ exists at the University of Oxford, where those who have just finished their exams would be greeted by a combination of shaving foam, glitter, and confetti, only to be washed away as the students throw themselves into the river. I wonder what your sartorial advice will be for an occasion such as this? Is there any way my suit (part of the dress code for exams) can still be salvageable after this ordeal?
Regards,
Dominic
I know it well Dominic, I went through the same thing. Then again, I had dyed my beard red at that point, and was shaving off a little off it after every exam. So I was to a certain extent trashing myself.
Thankfully, all my suits were very cheap back then. I can only suggest you wear your cheapest, try to avoid jumping in the river, and take it fairly quickly to the dry cleaner the next day.
You have to post photos of the red beard.
A cream cashmere hankie from A&S. I hope you never have to use it. Ha ha ?
No fear…. show not blow
I once worked in the Time Warner building in NYC and was presented with the horrible Sophie’s Choice, during an elevator ride, of offering my cashmere/silk Simonnot Godard hankie to a uncontrollably sneezing and snorting very famous super model on her way to a photo shoot or being a very public cad. As beautiful as she was, I couldn’t bring myself to imagine her blowing into my most cherished of squares. So, I shamefully, but discretely pushed it deep into my jacket pocket, safely hidden out of site as I turned my head away from her and her multitude of handlers. My friends say I missed the chance of marrying a super model. I say I saved a hankie.
Hi Simon,
The RAF turtleneck seems thick. Do you tuck it in?
No. Personally I never tuck knitwear in, it seems too affected. And with this you wouldn’t be able to because of its thickness. But you shouldn’t need to either, given the way it sits around the waist.
Thanks for your response.
I feel that tucking knitwear it feels warmer, but it may only look non-affected with a sports coat on
The link to the Fox website doesn’t work.
Thanks
These trousers also look great. If they would fit too wide, would you use the side adjuster buttons or have them altered?
You mean if the waist was too big? Probably have them altered
I’m wondering as to the weight of the denim shirt. Would you happen to know or have some idea?
It’s on their website – 10oz
I live in Hong Kong. Given the sawtooth shirt weighs 10oz, I suppose it’s only for autumn/winter here? I am very in buying one but I am not sure if it is wearable in Hong Kong…
It is quite nice in warmer weather, but yes in Hong Kong it might be for only half of the year
Do you know of any store (now that the pop-up is gone) that stocks the sawtooth denim shirt in London?
No, sorry Johannes. Brycelands doenst have many stockists, it’s mostly just their shops
Just checking – sadly this is still true, right? No stockists in Europe?
Yep, sorry
Just to update this – with Perro now there is a stockist
https://perroofficial.com/products/brycelands-10oz-denim-western-shirt
Best
j
Thank you
Hi Simon,
How would you compare Bryceland’s and Private VC’s rollneck pullovers? I understand you own both.
On the note of colour, I notice your preference for navy as it’s the most versatile. What do you think of the other colours for rollneck in a wardrobe, e.g. light grey, ecru/off white?
Thanks.
Most rollnecks are pretty similar – fortunately the Brycelands one is very different, so it’s easy to separate them.
The Brycelands model has a very slim, very large rib at the bottom, which stretches out to any size of waist, and then rolls down from the body. The body is then larger than most rollnecks. So it is secure at the waist, but large and flattering in the body. It’s a much more traditional cut. Also not one I’d probably wear under a jacket. PWVC is much more standard, with just small differences.
Light or flannel grey is my next favourite, the only issue there being it can’t go with grey trousers. Navy has the same problem, that it can’t go with navy or dark-denim trousers. Cream goes with everything, but is a little showy. Dark green is probably the most useful for a lot of guys, after navy, because it has none of these issues. But it must be a dark green.
Thanks for the reply, Simon.
I can certainly understand the reason for preference for navy in relation grey trousers.
On the note of cream being showy, I certainly think they stand out more compared to navy or light grey but I do think they can look rather elegant.
I own one sawtooth as well. it bled slightly into the belt-loop area of the trousers. i think it is normal. how did you overcome this when you wear a pair of beige trousers like this?
To be honest, my Sawtooth didn’t bleed at all. Did you wash it once before wearing it? That might be a good tip
Yes I washed once already. The bleeding is not serious. But there is still some. That’s why I am curious how you overcame it. Anyway thanks. It should be better after a few more washes!
hey simon i assume you had the chance to try on the cabana shirt… how would you advise sizing and are the sleeves in your size too slim?
It wasn’t really my style I’m afraid so I didn’t check it for sizing etc. Sorry
hi simon, given your praise on the sawtooth shirt, it came as a surprise that you listed it on marrrkt- is there any reason you’ve listed it as i was planning to perhaps purchase this in the upcoming pop up.
I had two – a 48 and a 50. I couldn’t decide which was the right size. I ended up staying with the 50, so sold the 48. I absolutely love it
Hi Simon, do you find the armholes on the sawtooth westerner to be particularly high? I have one that fits me nicely otherwise but I feel is very snug under the armpits.
Not particularly, no, but I can imagine that being a lot about physiology
Hello AJ – I have the same problem. The armholes feel particularly high compared with other shirts I have. How did you resolve this problem if I may ask?
This is a thing with a lot of Japanese denim shirts. I always assumed it was because they made them for the Japanese physique. On a raw denim shirt you can feel it even more as it’s heavy fabric. I thought that brycelands would have designed their own pattern and avoided this issue but perhaps that’s not the case.
Hi simon how does the bryceland chino compare in fit with the Armoury ones?
I have the Armoury flat front and gurkha chinos and am considering whether to add the bryceland ones if there is value add. Also is the bryceland one more of a beige as compared the the khaki of the Armoury?
Yes Brycelands is more of a beige. And the style is bigger – a real high rise and a fuller leg
Do you think this fit has been updated over the years? Standard and Strange (U.S. store) is now selling them and they don’t look so extreme….
No, I think it’s always been the same cut
Hey simon, I notice in a couple of articles where you often write that this shirt/trouser/suit has become a favourite piece of yours. I’m wondering in your years of wearing/acquiring so many fine pieces of clothing, what may be some of the pieces you simply keep reaching to wear daily and what may be some you initially thought you would like but ended but not wearing often.
Hey Shem. I cover this a little when I do my ‘How great things age’ series, but perhaps something that looks back at everything over the past few years would be a good idea.
To be honest, it was also the kind of thing I was trying to summarise in the budget (non-budget!) article recently
Hi Simon,
I’m replacing my collection of oxford shirts and am considering your selection of Oxfords, Bryceland’s Perfect OCBDs, and Drake’s Regular or Slim Fit Oxfords. I thought I’ll first get your opinion on their fit, fabric, and construction. There’s no place close to me where I can try any of these brands, so purchasing online will be my only option. I appreciate any thoughts you have.
Hi Arthur,
Well obviously I’m biased, as I’ve designed what I think is the perfect OCBD. However, I can say that Bryceland’s has some great traditional style details that the others don’t (eg locker loop) and Drake’s is more of an English make, the PS ones more Italian.
The cloth of the PS ones is a little heavier and slubbier as mentioned. I can’t add much more as I haven’t owned the other two though. Sorry
How’d you size in the RAF Rollneck compared to the Sawtooth Westerner? I know you mentioned you ended up with the 40 in the westerner. Cheers!
I would be a 40 in the rollneck too, but actually went for a 42 because I wanted a bigger, roomy size, and the tight waist meant it didn’t look too big there
Thank you! I feel I’m a bit on the fence between a 38 and 40 in the westerner (~38.5-39” true chest, 34” true waist, 15.5-15.75” neck), but I’m leaning 40 based on your comments.
I would do.
Ethan would always say his style leans a little more towards the blousy as well, and a larger size makes it possible to put something thin under it if you need to
Hi Simon. Would like to know how has your experience been with Bryceland’s Type 1 Denim Jacket after owning it for almost one year, particularly regarding its length (but also, in general, its quality and style). I’m considering one for myself, but I’m hesitant since I’m tall (6’4″) and based in NYC, so can’t try it on or easily return it. Thanks in advance!
The quality is very good, and I’d have no doubts there.
But do consider the style carefully. It is short, and gets shorter with wear. You might find it’s only good with really high-rise trosuers
Simon, on your recommendation, I recently bought the sawtooth western shirt and I’m loving it. I’d appreciate your advice as to how to style it – would you wear it with tailored wool trousers (i.e., flannels, cav twills, etc.) or only more casual trousers such as chinos and cords? Thanks!
I wear it with all of them. Its more natural partner is chinos or cords, but it also makes a nice contrast with flannels
Simon,
I’m thinking of ordering one of the USN chambray shirts next fall, but it’s hard to evaluate the shirt online. What differentiates this from less expensive work shirts that I’ve seen? The styling looks very casual—is it particularly well-made? How would you wear something like this (as a way to dress down tailoring, dress up very casual outfits, etc.)? Thank you in advance.
I don’t know the details on the product I’m afraid, so I can’t really help. And I don’t own one myself.
That kind of thing can be a good way to dress down tailoring though, yes. Particularly if the collar is high enough to work under a jacket.
Hi the most impt aspect is the fit and measurements. Check if it suits you. I have ordered the bryceland chambray and ended up returning it. The shoulders are too huge for the chest. Meaning if you get the chest right the shoulders will be far too huge and the reverse is true. Also the chest pockets are too large and too low. Something you might want to note about bryceland is that returns cannot be returned for refund and only for store credits/item exchange so make sure there are items you want to get if the chambray doesn’t work out for you. I ended up getting the Armoury x real mccoy chambray which I think is great. I would think alot of other brands do great chambrays too
Nice shirt. I am thinking about buying a western shirt. Do you think that they in general should fit quite slim (like a smart shirt) or should they be oversized (like the current fashion)?
A little oversized or blousy I think. Particularly given their thickness
Hi simon assuming the cabana shirt had a smaller collar would you have seen yourself getting one and how would you have styled it? I assume the shirt cannot be tucked in due to the hip pockets(https://www.brycelandsco.com/collections/shirts-1/products/brycelandscabanashirtnavy)
Perhaps, yes. I have two Gitman Bros shirts I wear in a similar manner – they are lightweight linen, and I would wear them untucked with shorts, or with a vest underneath if it wasn’t quite warm enough for that. An alternative to shorts would be linen trousers
Thanks Simon can you recall if you were more of an m or l in that. I’m a size 40 in the sawtooth which I think is similar to you
I can’t remember, sorry Shem
Hi Simon,
I’m really attracted by the denim sawtooth shirt. Having owned for a while, have you found that it shrinks at all with washing? Any other readers have any experience with the shirt they could share, especially with regards to fit and shrinkage?
If there has been any shrinkage, it has been minimal. I haven’t noticed much.
Still, given it’s thickness I would take a size up if you’re in doubt. I tried both but ended up with a 40 rather than a 38. They’re designed to be a little blousy as well
hello Mr. Crompton. Would you please let us know what do you think of Brycelands towel/voile shirts? Thanks.
They’re not me, to be honest. I definitely see the appeal, and they can look cool, but the style is a little too unusual
Simon, what color did you go for in the RAF roll neck? Are still fond of it? Thanks
Navy.
And yes I am, I really like the fullness in the body. Though the waist does ride up a bit – might be easier if I was shorter or wore high-rise trousers
Hi Simon- any chance you have the Brycelands USN chambray shirt? I have the denim sawtooth and love it but find I don’t wear it that often because, when not wearing a suit, I’m often in jeans. I was considering the chambray as a good match for denim and wondered if you had tried it out. Thanks.
I haven’t, sorry Justin
Hi Simon, can I ask what size did you take in the lee kung mun? Large?
Medium actually. It feels tight at first, but not after a little bit
Are you wearing a Tank Basculante here? Very nice!
The Chronoflex
Dear Simon,
I hope this finds you well. I have a couple of questions about your thoughts on a few Bryceland’s pieces and would really be very grateful for any help.
1. On this review you mention that, while you considered the black sawtooth western shirt, you decided against given black would be hard to integrate with the rest of your casual wardrobe. Since writing this, you have published a few articles and pictures (not to mention the Friday Polo in black) about how you have come to wear more black. Would you now wear Bryceland’s black sawtooth? If yes, how would you style it?
2. Also in this review, you say that you opted not to buy the Bryceland’s chore coat because it was too A-line. But I noticed that on another later post you featured the cream version of it. I wonder what has been your experience with it, and whether you would recommend it. Relatedly, did you consider their jelt denim version? If yes, would you mind saying why did you go for the cream?
I realize of course that these are rather long and obnoxious questions and apologize in advance.
1. I would consider it, and you’re right I would wear black more often now. But I would still go for the indigo or white first, just because I think they would be easier to wear than the black, and have less risk of looking too unusual as well.
2. Good point again, I did later buy the chore coat. To be honest, I haven’t worn it enough yet to know how I will like it. I think the cream has a small risk of looking like a doctor’s coat, but if everything else is very casual, and the jacket pretty rumpled, then it’s ok. The jelt denim I didn’t like that much, just as a denim colour
Hi Simon,
Reviving this thread to see whether you now have a more informed opinion as to the Bryceland’s ecru denim chore coat? Thanks.
I do, and I have worn it a fair bit. You can see me wearing it in this article.
I had it narrowed a little, to make it less A-line. I’m not sure I like it that much over tailoring though – more just over knitwear.
I thought I would add my experience on fit and shrinkage in case it is useful. I take a 39/40 depending on cut, I about 33 waist. When the size 40 shirt arrived I thought I had made a mistake as it was almost comically long in the sleeve and large in the shoulder, but as the waist fit well I thought I should wash it and give it a chance. After 2 to 3 washes it had shrunk dramatically and now after 4 to 5, it fits perfectly and while it hasn’t softened much is very comfortable and in fact supportive in a way thinner shirts are not.
One point to note is that I do not have large wrists but the cuff when fastened is very snug, probably why in photos people tend to wear the sleeves turned back or rolled up.
Thanks for this insight. I’ve been on the fence about 38 vs 40 for a while now (39-39.5 inch chest, 33 waist, 6 ft, 170 lbs). Would you be able to share how the measurements shook out after all the washes? Cheers!
If in doubt I’d definitely size up. There’s a little shrinkage in there.
Hey Simon,
Very interesting read on the sawtooth shirt. Now I’m intrigued at this one under tailoring. What’s your thoughts on sizing? I’m a Large in your shirts with a 44” chest. Should I go for the 44? Will the neck be huge? Any other sawtooth shirts you would recommend?
It’s hard to give advice on the shirting without a few more measurements Joel. I would recommend looking at the Sawtooth measurements and comparing them to the shirts (such as the PS ones) you already have. And if in doubt, take the size up. There will be a small amount of shrinkage
I also contemplated the brycelands shirt but then went with the Warehouse 3001 Longhorn type Denim Western Shirt (widely available + easy exchanges). I really love the shirt, great make and details. The style is a little simpler, the fabric is sturdy but softens nicely – the weight is also 10oz. Long enough to be worn tugged in. As others I would recommend no buying a close fit as there will be shrinkage.
I have this longhorn aswell. I have very typical dimensions but found the sleeves quite long, and the armhole is quite high aswell which can pull under the arm. Did you find the same?
Simon, would you wear the Sawtooth as an Overshirt, i.e., untucked over a tshirt with chinos?
No I wouldn’t, it’s too long. Same as any other dress shirt
And would/could you have it shortened or re-hemmed?
No, I’d look for something else. If it’s not meant to be worn that way I wouldn’t try and change it
Makes sense thanks. Any ideas or suggestions as to where? Much appreciated.
No, sorry I can’t be more helpful, but I don’t really wear shirts like that
No worries and thanks, really appreciate the input. I guess my issue is that I want a denim top layer and have issues with the typical denim jackets (i.e., types I, II or IIII) being shorter than I’d like.
As to those typical denim jackets, is there one type you like better over the others? For reference: Type I (https://therealmccoys.com/collections/outerwear/products/lot-001xxj-early-model), Type II (https://therealmccoys.com/collections/outerwear/products/mj18030-140) and Type III (https://therealmccoys.com/collections/outerwear/products/real-mccoys-lot-004j).
No, I don’t think there’s a big difference.
If you want a denim top layer, maybe look at a chore jacket.
Thanks Simon. That is a great suggestion and not an area I had look into before. After spending an inexcusable amount of time today looking at options online, I’m keen on 2 models: The Real McCoys (https://therealmccoys.com/collections/outerwear/products/8hu-denim-chore-coat) and Bryceland’s (https://www.brycelandsco.com/collections/coats-jackets/products/brycelandschorecoat).
I would be much obliged if you could share your thoughts on both, even if only based on what’s available on their respective websites. Thanks in advance.
I can’t say much, except the jelt denim is much lighter in weight and colour, and not what you’d normally expect from denim. I’d be more hesitant about getting that if you haven’t seen it in person
I would neither go for drastic alterations but in the spirit of the today’s article and the example of another reader given in it: Why not take the freedom to wear it like an overshirt if you like the look? „ If it’s not meant to be worn that way I wouldn’t try and change it“ seems a little too strict to me.
Good point J.
What I really mean is, it’s not meant to be worn that way, which means it will create quite a specific effect that the designer didn’t intend. As long as you understand that, that’s fine. So you need to be OK with having an overshirt that’s longer than everyone else’s, and with a curved bottom to the hem.
The reason I’d usually recommend against something like that is because you’re probably buying the garment because you like the designer’s approach. So it’s more risky ignoring that, as it’s more likely to be a look you end up not liking.
But there are no absolutes here. Wear it that way if you like it.
Hi simon, wondering what is your take on this sawtooth variation (https://www.brycelandsco.com/collections/shirts-1/products/brycelandssawtoothwesternergreen). I dislike the denim version and already have other chambray shirts. So its between the Black and this. Would you see this as useful?
I wouldn’t wear it myself Shem. Personally because I don’t wear checks like that much, and because if I was going to, I’d wear it in a button-down, Ivy style, not a western shirt.
Why do you have to buy one or the other?
Hey simon, in trying to keep to a smaller wardrobe, I only restrict to getting one shirt in a certain style, especially something which I find quite unusual (as compared to a button down or straight up USN chambray shirt) like a sawtooth with the shoulder pattern/stitching. I was about to say that given your quite casual take on clothes recently, I actually think you will look pretty good with the patterned sawtooth!
I see, thanks Shem. To be honest, if you don’t like the denim version, I’d question whether you need a sawtooth in your wardrobe at all. You don’t need one of everything?
Very nice article. From what I understand Brycelands offer “two versions” of this shirt – one regular and one “washed”. They look similiar – and it might possibly be the same exact shirt – but one is pre-washed before it is sold i presume. Which ones did you buy if I might ask? The unwashed one?
Hi there,
I haven’t seen the ‘washed’ version – and haven’t tried it if there is one. I can’t see one on the site either?
In case other readers might want to know this option is only visible once you choose the size – you get the option to select a “washed” version – but from what I understand it just means that Brycelands has washed/dried the shirt once
Thank you
Hi Simon, with the Byrceland’s London pop-up coming up (at least that I last heard; who knows these days?), could I ask a couple of questions about the sawtooth? First, what do you expect the maximum amount of fading to be on the denim version you have? Generally I prefer paler shirts, and am a bit worried the darker one might be too much of a ‘look’ for me, even after many washes and wears. Second, have you seen/tried their chambray version at all? Thanks in advance!
Hey Joe,
It will get pale, but only after a lot of wear and washing, as in years probably. So I wouldn’t get it if you’re unsure about the colour. I haven’t tried the chambray version I’m afraid, no.
hi Simon, I know you don’t have much experience with bryceland rtw shirts but would like to ask your community of readers – i love the bryceland style but has anyone found their sizing finicky/on the very slim side. I’m not the biggest guy (174cm/65kg) but I have relatively wide shoulders/chest/biceps and I find their size (medium for me) very slim in the arms and narrow in the area between the chest/shoulder. Not sure if the armhole is also too small. Wanted to get opinion if other readers also feel the same or its just me. Thanks.
Hi Simon, regarding the sawtooth shirt – was wondering what your thoughts are re weight. Real Mccoy’s have an 8oz. version which im assuming counts as mid-weight.
Do you think this would be more versatile and could potentially go better with tailoring than the 10oz. version. Thanks!
Yes, a lighter version would be easier to wear with tailoring. I haven’t tried the Real McCoys one though, so can’t comment on any other aspects of it
Out of curiosity, what size are you wearing in the Lee Kung Man undershirt? The sizing of the shirt has always been far off what the label suggests for this particular shirt, for me. I had given up on it, but now you have me tempted again.
I’m not sure actually, I’ll have to check when I’m back at home. But I believe a regular size. They always feel tight when you put them on – particularly in the upper arm. But that’s how they’re meant to fit – you’ll find after a few minutes you don’t notice them anymore, which is the whole point of an undershirt
Hi Simon, Interesting. I agree they’re tight on the arms, especially. I had to give up on mine because they were cutting off my arm circulation.
For context, I wear a U.S. 38 jacket and usually fit to size Small on t-shirts which end up being quite fitted. With the Lee Kung Man undershirt I bought a size Large and it is by far the tightest shirt and even undershirt I’ve ever worn in any size.
After I posted on this topic (above), I did some searching around and I noticed one retailer of the Lee Kung Man shirts suggests sizing up two sizes from your normal size. That would place me at a size XL, which seems very strange.
Anyway, curious to see what size you own, when you get a chance. I’d guess by the above standard you’d be an XXL (which they do sell), although I suspect you don’t actually own an XXL.
Yes I don’t think so, but you may be right on sizing up certainly. Perhaps arm circulation depends on size of bicep etc as well
Dear Simon,
I hesitate to order the western shirt, unfortunately the western shirt has runned out of stock in my size (40). I would be glad, if you have a second recommendation for a similar item?
best regards
christopher
I don’t I’m afraid Christopher. I haven’t tried any others
hi simon, I’m wondering given the casualisation/increasingly dressed down nature of society these days, I’m wondering if there can be a deeper dive and exploration of more casual shirtings more specifically workshirts like chambrays and westerners. I particularly like the article written by your guest writer (Manish I think it was?) where he explored pieces from different brands, sizing and prices.
Nice idea Shem, OK we can look at that. So starting with ways to wear those types of shirts, and how they can work as substitutes for smarter shirts (and not)?
Yes. This may be useful for other readers. For myself (and possibly more advanced readers) I’m quite certain of how those shirts can be worn and mixed and matched. For me the more useful thing is that you (and by extension the range of guest writers) have vast experience wearing and handling different brands in a style of clothing (e.g. different types of ocbd, different types of sawtooth etc.) and discuss about some of the popular shirts in detail within that range (e.g. in a range of denim/chambray shirts you have cheaper ones like buzz rickson to bryceland to orslow etc. What makes them different, what are some of their idiosyncrasies and points to consider in purchasing one over the other etc. E.g. bryceland sizing is tricky etc. I think those tips will really be useful as permanent style will serve as a repository of knowledge across different brands. The issue with many clothing stores is that they will simply promote their own clothes they sell but are often unable to comment meaningfully about how theirs may differ to about brands they don’t carry.
I see. Ok, thanks Shem, understood
Hi simon, I always liked how bryceland styled their sawtooth shirts and i managed to source my first sawtooth/denim shirt (a vintage lee that hasnt been washed or worn). Its mostly definitely a lighter weight than the bryceland one as it is quite soft to the touch (maybe 8oz at the most?) and is very comfortable on is own. However I found it very hard to wear under a sportscoat, especially in the sleeves, and found it pretty uncomfortable. My sportsjackets are from the armoury which are hardly trim and in my size. Do you face the same issue and would it get better with wash and wear as the shirt gets softer?
I don’t to be honest, but I really only wear mine with heavier tweed jackets, and they might perhaps be cut a little roomier than your Armoury ones, even if they’re not skinny?
Picked one of these up when in NYC recently and love it. I sized up from a 42 (which fitted perfectly before washing) to a 44 to be sure the sleeves and shoulders still fit after any shrinkage (which after a few washes looks like it was the right call), but that means the fit in the waist has gone from trim to relatively blousy.
Has anyone had one of these altered at all? I have doubts that darts will work, but taking in the side seams seems like it might . If anyone has made changes, did they use a standard alternation tailors, or find a denim specialist? Any recommendations?
Speaking of recommendations, if in NYC, I can highly recommend a trip Standard and Strange. Service was excellent – positive without being pushy, and highly knowledgeable without being condescending and the range of clothes/brands was great. If you get a chance to visit Simon I think they’d be a good shout for adding to an updated City guide?
Thanks, and yes good idea
Hi Simon, on those type of very casual shirts, do you prefer biggger / pointier collars? This one seems fairly big but I guess it comes with the style and goes well with heavy denim.
I wouldn’t say so particularly, no. I think I prefer a slightly larger collar on most shirts. This one isn’t that large, I think it’s actually smaller than my buttondowns if the buttondowns were not buttoned, and lower in the neck too
Hi simon, apart from a sportcoat and thick outerwear like overcoats, are there any intermediate layers that you wear over the sawtooth shirt? I have a vintage lee westerner shirt sinilar in style and detail to the bryceland one whixh i struggle to layer over. It looks great on its own but notbing else (apart from a sportcoat) seems quite right witb it. A denim jacket/chore coat looks to samey. An overahirt looks too smart and incongruent in style. I have q vintage cycling jacket that looks off with it too. Do you face that struggle?
I think you’re best off looking to cardigans Shem – a chunky shawl collar, a decent lambswool, a mohair, even a loopwheel one
Hi Simon, Have you tried the 100Hands western shirt and I would be interested to see your take on it, I love them totally and the fabric is just brilliant and nicely washed
I haven’t, no sorry
Hi Simon,
The Brycelands chore coat looks interesting and is now more achievable given the new London shop. I don’t mind the A-line fit – I have an A-line shaped body after all. But I am unsure about the jelt fabric (maybe too blue) and the white stitching (which contrasts a bit too much to my mind). What do you think? I can see you mention the fabric favourably here but less so in other articles.
Best wishes
Rob
I’ve never owned and worn the jelt, so it’s hard to say anything concrete. But it does soften down quite a lot with wear – try and find images of the trousers or chore after some wear and washing
To be honest for a Western clientele, the sawtooths probably do need an additional, 7th snap button.
I think it depends a lot on your trouser rise as well, Rob. If you wear a modern, low rise that could definitely be an issue, but it’s not what the brand or I would wear
Hi Simon had you tried the traditional shoes and if yes what is your take on it? And do you know who makes them? (Only indicated made in Japan) thanks
Sorry, which are the traditional shoes?
I don’t know who any of their makers are in Japan though, but I wouldn’t put much store in that knowledge if I did. It’s rarely as good an indicator of quality as people think it is
Apologies, I was referring to the cap toe oxfords. The link: https://www.brycelandsco.com/collections/shoes/products/cornobluaquila?variant=35704699191451
The maker is Cornu Blu I believe? I don’t know anything more about them though I’m afraid
Hi Simon. Do you know what weight the black western shirt is that Brycelands offer?
No I don’t, sorry.
Hey simon, i noticed you sold off the bryceland teardrop chambray shit on marrkt. May i ask why? Is it a matter of fit or? Also curious in that I have never seen you wear it in any of the pictures on permenant style.
It was partly the fit and partly the small collar shape. I much preferred the other Bryceland’s chambray and found I rarely wore that one, so I thought this one should go to a better home
Hi Simon, I think I’ll be pulling the trigger on the Sawtooth Westerner in denim soon, having discovered how much I love wearing a Westerner both casually and with compatible sports jackets.
Noting how heavy it is, I was also thinking about getting the Bryceland’s version in white cotton, which would be better for warmer weather. I thought this would be a nice alternative to a white OCBD shirt, do you agree? Or do you think one should really only wear it in the same way as the denim version?
I think it would be a nice alternative, yes. It would be fairly unusual and you might find you wear it rather less than a white oxford, but it would still be nice. The cotton is still heavy FYI, so it won’t be a huge amount cooler
Thanks Simon, I didn’t realise the white version was so heavy, good to know!
To close the loop, and in case it interests anyone else, I ended up purchasing the Rubato Roper shirt (in both indigo and white). The main reason was that the denim is lighter weight then the Bryceland’s, which is better for where I live, but still uses a 3×1 twill which still feels like it has substance/body despite the lighter weight. Not staying one is better than the other, just different.
Hi Simon,
do you find the colour of the deep blue sawtooth shirts comes off on a white undershirt?
if so does it easily come off from the latter in the wash?
I didn’t find that, no. But if you’re concerned at all just wash it once or twice before you wear it
Dear all,
I wanted to praise the RAF turtleneck. It’s really comfortable, it has a great look and is quite warm. This spring I have been enjoying it so much that I decided to buy additional colours. The Spaniel (brown) is the one to have, so versatile, and next for me is ecru and black.
the sawtooth shirt I have not been enjoying too much because our of the box it comes so stiff that it’s a bit like a jeans jacket but not as roomy, so I can’t have anything underneath. I am trusting the process that in 5-6 wears it will become more comfortable but so far it’s been more of a negative experience for me. I find it that the older I grow, the less patience I have for breaking in new clothes. When I was a student in university I would give months of discomfort to break in a 25 oz pair of iron hearts. The last ones I got after about 5 wears I just gave away.
i consider Bryceland’s to be very fairly priced and it’s either I have been in this menswear bubble too long and my perception is skewed or they provide a good quality/price ratio.
best,
Peter